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PWInsider.com sat down with TNA's John Skyler over the weekend. Here is the complete transcript:
Mike Johnson: Testing. Hey everybody, it's Mike Johnson in the audio section of PWInsiderElite.com. As you hear, this is Monday morning, and that means that we're just a couple of days away from TNA live in Philadelphia at the Liacouras Center. A number of big matches taking place, and I'm very happy to be sitting down with a member of Order 4, one of the Good Hands, John Skyler. As his loyalties may be torn this week, as the International Champion, Mustafa Ali, will be defending against John Skyler's best friend and tag team partner, Jason Hotch. Sir, we're sitting here at The Gathering in Charlotte, North Carolina. Thank you for carving out a couple of minutes of your time. First of all, how are you doing?
John Skyler: I'm doing great. It's always good to be here at The Gathering. It's always great to see you, of course.
Mike Johnson: First place we ever met was here.
John Skyler: Yeah, coming to these reunions is always fun. It's funny, the first time I ever came to one of these things, I was actually still a senior in high school, and I skipped out on senior picture day to come meet Bret Hart. So...
Mike Johnson: Do you regret it?
John Skyler: What's that?
Mike Johnson: Do you regret it now?
John Skyler: Oh, no! Of course not. Yeah, I mean I got to meet Bret Hart, so it was all worth it. Yeah, who cares about senior picture day when you got The Hitman here? So...
Mike Johnson: So let's—we'll talk Bret Hart in a second. But when it comes to Philly, obviously TNA on AMC, the company's on an upswing, the numbers have been very good in recent weeks. Now it's the latest live episode, and you're involved in a situation where the loyalties might be torn on camera. Obviously a great opportunity for Jason, I do believe the match will be great bell-to-bell. Just overall thoughts on the scenario and the story.
John Skyler: It's been a wild couple of months for the group, Order 4, and this—obviously with Thursday being live on AMC, that live energy is always a little bit different, obviously. And I think that's going to play a factor into everything. But also you got the Philadelphia crowd, and as you know, Philadelphia's one of the—one of the best die-hard wrestling crowds that there is, so...
Mike Johnson: It was the upside down way before there was Stranger Things.
John Skyler: Absolutely. So it'll be interesting to see not only maybe where my allegiance falls, but what is the Philadelphia crowd going to do this Thursday? That's also something to think about. Are they going to be—are they going to be pro-Ali or are they going to be pro-Jason Hotch? It's going to be an interesting situation. And, you know, it's one of those things where do I go with my head or do I go with my heart? You know, because Ali obviously has given me a tremendous opportunity when he went to bat for me and Jason to be a part of this group, and I think it's done wonders for our career. Or do I follow my heart and support my tag team partner? So it's very much a weird situation for myself to be in. But without a doubt, it's going to be a tremendous match.
Mike Johnson: I did want to ask you about that. You had a lot of years where you were what I call a journeyman indie wrestler, going everywhere you can just to make your dollar, sell some merchandise, get to the next town, and support yourself. How has being part of TNA, being signed by that company, and knowing that no matter what, you've got those dates every month, you've got that guaranteed money every month... How has that changed your life compared to the days of running around just trying to hit every indie scene you can?
John Skyler: You know, not much has really changed. Obviously, my schedule's a lot busier, and I like that. And it's cool to have wrestling be my primary source of income now after all—as you said, being a journeyman and having all those years under my belt of really, you know, grinding and trying to get there. Now, it's almost like—it's a cliché thing, but it's like the real work starts now. So, like, you know, I've been with TNA for five years now, and I don't—I feel like we still haven't even scratched the surface of what myself, Jason Hotch, and even the group Order 4... I don't think we've even scratched the surface yet on what we're capable of doing. But yeah, things have changed, and they've all changed for the better, you know? It's nice to go around and be recognized from AMC, and, you know, it's fun, man. And, you know, obviously like everything we're doing with Order 4 has been cooking on all cylinders, and dare I say, we've been a pretty good focal point of the show for the last several months.
Mike Johnson: I feel like anytime there's a multi-team scenario, it's always, "Oh, we're going to put Skyler and Hotch in, because Skyler can be a good base for everybody." Do you consider that a curse or do you consider that a blessing?
John Skyler: I don't know! I mean, you go back to the name The Good Hands or The Great Hands. That's an inside baseball term, but, you know, like that's always been deemed a curse. "Oh, he's so good, he can make everybody look great, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah."
Mike Johnson: Well, that goes back many generations. If you're a good worker, sometimes you're used to put over the more charismatic talent who's not as much of a good worker.
John Skyler: I think a lot of that is just based off my Southern upbringing, too. Doing the Southern independents, riding in the car with Rock 'n' Roll Express all those years, and learning from those guys, and the Steve Corinos of the world. You know, like, I think really a lot of that style, that work rate, whatever you want to call it, I think I really attribute a lot of it to my Southern upbringing. And, you know, yeah, the multi-team scenarios, you have a point. Yeah, they always put us in there, and, you know, I'm flattered by it as well because it shows that the office and the company trusts us. When you have guys like The Hardys out there, especially that are in the later parts of their career, they need to have somebody out there that they can trust. And I definitely think that if you ask Matt and Jeff—if you were to sit down and do an interview with them, I would dare say that they would tell you the same thing, that they trust me and Hotch when we're out there with them. And it's not only them, it's even maybe the greener guys and the newer guys. You know, they trust us to make them look good too and go out there and, you know, not carry them or walk them or hold them by the hand, but, you know, they know that we're not going to do anything to jeopardize anybody. We're going to try to do our best to, if anything, accentuate people's positives.
Mike Johnson: Thoughts on Mila Moore being added to the group? Because I thought that has a nice different dimension now that you've got two very alpha female personalities with Tasha and Mila in there.
John Skyler: Yeah, I will say I think I have a new favorite member of Order 4.
Mike Johnson: I can imagine why.
John Skyler: Yeah, Mila's obviously very nice to look at, very attractive woman. And I think this is going to be a great learning experience for her, too. You know, she's still fairly new in her career, and I think being plugged into the group I think is going to be good for her. It should definitely be interesting to see, because you know as well as I do, having been around the business for a long time, there is a thing called girl heat!
Mike Johnson: Oh yeah. You don't want to be in the middle of that.
John Skyler: So with spontaneous combustion that could go on between her and Tasha, you know, you never know, because I've been around Tasha too and she's got that, you know, Latin temper. And so, it should be interesting to see how everything plays out.
Mike Johnson: You know, one thing I do want to ask you is, for much of your career, you had relied mostly on the physicality of being in the ring, performing in the ring, interacting with the audience. What was the learning curve like when it came to figuring out how to present yourself in the vignettes and the backstage scenes and playing off of Ali and everybody else? Because you had never really tapped into a lot of that. You were someone that like, you go to an independent, you were one of the guys tapped to have a good match. So getting to play into other aspects of your personality and your work, what was that like, the learning curve like with TNA?
John Skyler: I love it! It's been a tremendous learning experience for me because, obviously, as you know, this is my first television wrestling contract. And I've gotten to see all aspects of the business now from the television standpoint. So, I've gotten to do things like commentary, managing, more promos, backstage vignettes, on top of the wrestling stuff. And things like—I love doing the commentary! Like, I enjoy, you know...
Mike Johnson: I think you have an aptitude for that! The first time I heard you do it, I said, "Ah, this will be him in 20 years. He can be on commentary."
John Skyler: Well, I'm a big mark for Jesse Ventura, so, you know, maybe one day. But, yeah, it's been a really fun learning curve, and getting plugged into these things, again, that the office trusts me to do, it's been fun. It's been, you know... It's good to be the wrestling guy, and it's good to have built that career, and I still enjoy the wrestling part of it. But I'm really fascinated by all the aspects now of television wrestling, and it's really taught me a lot. And when I come to something like this, it helps me teach others. It shows like this, or on the independents, you know, like you have to look at wrestling from all these different perspectives. You have to look at it as a fan, you have to look at it from the commentary, from the backstage producer role, and as a talent in the ring. So it's really opened my eyes a lot to just all the moving parts of professional wrestling.
Mike Johnson: You know, when you think about the TNA on AMC run thus far, you know, it seems like TNA always has a cycle where something good happens, something bad happens, there's bad mojo on the internet. But I felt like Slammiversary was like the show where like everybody kind of came together to like kick all the critics in the teeth. What was that energy like backstage before and then after the show, given like... I thought it was one of the best shows TNA put on the last couple of years. What was that energy like from inside the bubble?
John Skyler: Amazing! For me, obviously, selfishly, me and Jason put a lot of pressure on ourselves. And I don't mind saying this, you know, we were originally supposed to be in the four-way ladder match, and we were taken out. And we had to fight to get back in. And that was a talk that we had to have, and we got put back in. So we put a lot of pressure on ourselves on that specific night, with everything else going on in the company, to really deliver a great performance for us. But you're exactly right, that Slammiversary show from top to bottom was the show that the company needed. And I think, you know, that's always been the story of TNA, is that if all else fails, you can always rely on the talent to go out and hit a home run there. And that's been from day one, you know?
Mike Johnson: When there's a scenario like that where they say, "Well, you're part of this, but then you're not," what's the mindset of arguing to get back in, and how often do you worry, "Oh, if I say something, I'm going to get heat and then they're not going to use me later"?
John Skyler: One of the best pieces of advice I've gotten since being a part of Order 4 came from Mustafa Ali, and it was: "Closed mouths don't get fed." So it's: Do we speak up about this and feel strongly about it and maybe get a chance and an opportunity, or do we keep our mouths shut and just sit on the sidelines? We've done that now, so it was time for us to speak up. And we're not—I don't think we have the reputation of being complainers or anything like that, and we wanted to make that known as well, but we had what we felt was like a valid argument, and they agreed. And so we got back in. Right now, I can honestly tell you, I haven't felt more creatively fulfilled than I do right now in a very long time. And I think that's really good. You know, obviously the money is great, but also I'm—being a fan of this for so long, like I really need to feel creatively fulfilled, and I feel creatively fulfilled right now. And that's... You know, I don't foresee myself leaving TNA anytime soon.
Mike Johnson: Obviously, big opportunity for Jason on Thursday. What has been like, you know, when that team was first put together, how familiar were you guys with each other on a personal level, and how quickly did that bond come together? Because you play off of each other so well in the ring. When does that start to congeal and gel?
John Skyler: It took a while. Me and Jason did not know each other. We literally showed up to TV and they said, "All right, you guys are a team now."
Mike Johnson: That's what happened to Brian Pillman and Steve Austin.
John Skyler: "Skyler, you're going to work—you're going to be with this kid now. He just won Gut Check. We have high hopes for him. Let's see what you guys can do." And so it took some time, we had some growing pains obviously because we didn't know each other. But we have legit bonded and gelled over the last three years, and it's kind of crazy that we've been a team that long now. And to see the development and the growth that we've both had as a team, it's pretty special. And again, going back to the group Order 4, you know as well as I do that when it comes to factions in wrestling, like back in the day, factions were put together in hopes of maybe one guy coming out of it on the other side being a star...
Mike Johnson: One person being the focus like Ric Flair was for the Horsemen.
John Skyler: Yeah, or Rocky in the Nation, or whatever. But I really feel like when it's all said and done with Order 4, I feel like everybody that's been a part of this group's going to come out of the other side a star. And I think people are going to realize that this Thursday when Jason gets his opportunity for the International title against Ali.
Mike Johnson: Well, there's a lot going on on the TNA show on Thursday, but since it's airing on AMC, you're going to have some fans in the Philly area going to be like, "Ah, I don't need to go." Why should they make sure they come to the Liacouras Center?
John Skyler: Well, for one, there's nothing like a live experience of a TNA show. If you're a fan in Philadelphia and you've been a long-time wrestling fan, you know what the energy of a Philadelphia crowd is like. So, I always encourage people to come out, because also, believe it or not, the cameras keep rolling even when the show goes off the air! You never know who's going to show up, and you never know what's going to happen when the cameras stop... when we go off the air on AMC, you never know what you're going to get to see live.
Mike Johnson: That is true! And they tape extra stuff like Xplosion, which you pop up on that quite a bit sometimes.
John Skyler: Yeah, yeah! I'm the King of Xplosion, brother!
Mike Johnson: You should get yourself a championship belt!
John Skyler: Yeah, right? I'll be the Xplosion Champion! No, yeah. And some of those matches, like real quick, we just did in Albany—we did a post-show dark match that was Order 4 versus Elijah, Rich Swann, and The Hardys. And we just had so much fun. And, you know, I'm thinking maybe it'll air sometime, but if it doesn't, the people in Albany got a treat, and it's something that they're going to talk about. And that's why I encourage people to come out and really see it live, because you don't know what you're going to get until you get there sometimes. And sometimes that's cool.
Mike Johnson: For yourself, you know, Hotch is getting a singles opportunity here this week. Do you want more of those for yourself, or do you feel just confident and fulfilled creatively right now being part of the overall group, being part of The Good Hands as a team?
John Skyler: Yeah, I don't ever want to rest on my laurels. I have high hopes for us still as a tag team, no matter what happens on Thursday. You know, I still think me and Jason both foresee ourselves being future TNA Tag Team Champions. I think that's something that we've worked hard for, and I think it's... I don't like to say this often because I don't think anything's really deserved necessarily, but I think we've earned it at this point. And so I definitely think long-term goal, I think we definitely still have high hopes of being Tag Team Champions. For me, a singles run would be great. I would love that, too. You know, I've always been a workhorse, so I like getting out there and at the end of the day, I'm still a meat-and-potatoes wrestler. I love doing that, too. But I am enjoying the journey, man, and I'm trying to hold on as long as I can to this run, because you know as well as I do, man, you never know when it's going to be over, so...
Mike Johnson: That's true, we're all ten seconds away from calamity. Bret Hart: best matches, favorite memories?
John Skyler: Oh my gosh! Obviously, my favorite match of his was him and Austin from WrestleMania 13.
Mike Johnson: Chicago, that was awesome.
John Skyler: Oh yeah! Just to me, you can plug that match—even though it happened in 1997, you could put that in any era and it would hold up. It kind of almost reminded me of an old, like, Mid-South match with the grittiness, and the dirtiness, and the rough around the edges. And I think that's why I liked it so much. And then, obviously, both guys came out of it, again, better than what they were when they went in. And that's the classic tale of: You don't have to go over to get over, right? Because what did Steve Austin do after that, right? So like...
Mike Johnson: Rested on his laurels.
John Skyler: But yeah, Bret's always a big childhood hero of mine, and, you know, it's... You know, he's the best there is, the best there was, the best there ever will be. And, you know, thankfully I got to meet him here at The Gathering.
Mike Johnson: I was lucky enough to be at WrestleMania X where he wrestled Owen.
John Skyler: Oh, what a match!
Mike Johnson: It was my favorite opening match on a wrestling show forever and a day.
John Skyler: I think it might be the best opening match in WrestleMania history. I mean, there's arguments...
Mike Johnson: Some people argue Triple H and Daniel Bryan, but I still feel Bret and Owen.
John Skyler: Yeah. Yeah.
Mike Johnson: I was in the Garden once—I know this floats around on YouTube because somebody stuck a camcorder in—but he worked Yokozuna in a cage in the Garden once. July 13th, 1993, that's how good it was, I remember the date. It was off the charts, like... And you would not expect... Yoko was such a chameleon, like the talent that he was is not what you expected when you looked at him, and it's like some of the best stuff he ever did was that match. Off the charts.
John Skyler: Oh man, yeah! Bret was so good and fluid with everybody, too, man. That was what I always loved about him, especially like when he would have a title run. You know, one week he'd be wrestling Tom Prichard, the next week he'd be wrestling Waylon Mercy, the next week he'd be wrestling Owen or Bulldog...
Mike Johnson: Yeah, I was at a lot of those early Raws, and he had like awesome matches with Fatu, Bam Bam Bigelow...
John Skyler: Oh, at the Manhattan Center! Yeah, those were brilliant. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, Bret's just... He's like, again—and I don't want to toot his horn too much because I'm going to sound biased—but Ali reminds me a lot of Bret in the way that he thinks about wrestling. Ali really looks at wrestling from so many facets and perspectives. Like, he eats, sleeps, and breathes professional wrestling, and his psychology is second to none. And he reminds me a lot of Bret in that regard, with the way that they can break things down and really, you know... Just the way that they put matches together and the storytelling and the excitement that comes from it is pretty... pretty remarkable. So I have to put Ali over in that regard.
Mike Johnson: So TNA airs on AMC, but the show's still airing on TNA+, everything past, present, and future is there. How often do you use that to kind of study opponents and even like go back and look at your own tape to improve yourself?
John Skyler: Dude, are you kidding me? I'm on TNA+ like literally every week. I just watched all the Asylum shows in order, starting from the beginning.
Mike Johnson: Some of those are rough, but some of them are great.
John Skyler: Some of them are very rough! You know, like, I hear people, you know, everybody's going to dump on TNA, it's just what people do, right? But, you know, when people are like, "Oh, it's doom and gloom, it's doom and gloom," I'm like, "Man, you should have seen some of the shit from the early years!" Watch that Jeff Jarrett documentary about Week 2!
John Skyler: Yeah! Yeah, but no, I... I'm still at the end of the day, man... You know, I was just talking to Matt Hardy about this last night. So many people try to put certain types of wrestling in a box, and they're like, "Oh, you can't be a fan of this type of wrestling or that type of wrestling." I like to look at wrestling like music. I have an eclectic taste in music. If you were to look at my playlist, you would get a little bit of everything. And I like my wrestling the same way. I think I have an eclectic taste in wrestling. So like, do I like all deathmatch wrestling? No, but there's some stuff that I can find that I like. And that goes with everything. So like, I'm at the end of the day still a big fan of professional wrestling, so I'm on TNA+ all the time. Whether it's scouting opponents or watching Jerry Lynn matches, you know? Like, I'm always on there and...
Mike Johnson: You can't go wrong with Jerry Lynn.
John Skyler: I'm the ultimate nerd, so... Yeah, I'm on... This sounds like a cheap plug for TNA+, but if you're a wrestling nerd like myself, trust me, it's worth the $9.99 or whatever it is.
Mike Johnson: Yeah, and if you miss the WWE Network, it's the same people that put it together, so it very much plays the same way. All right, so I got two more—one more question for you.
John Skyler: You said two! You can ask two if you want.
Mike Johnson: Well, I'm going to give you the chance to answer the second one on your own.
John Skyler: Okay.
Mike Johnson: So, everyone got to vote as to who the number one contender should be for Ali. Who would you vote for?
John Skyler: Well, I couldn't vote for myself. D-Ray 3000 is no longer active, so...
Mike Johnson: Ah, he's not? I missed that retirement match.
John Skyler: Yeah. I think Shark Boy was booked in Sheboygan that day. So, are you asking me, in confidence, who I voted for?
Mike Johnson: Well, we're on record.
John Skyler: On record? Oh, I think I'm going to plead the Fifth. I'm going to look like Mark Fuhrman here.
Mike Johnson: I know for a fact, my sources tell me, you voted for Cheex.
John Skyler: What a deep cut!
Mike Johnson: The deepest of cuts! Before we get out of here, obviously there's a lot of people who have supported you from the days here in Charlotte and The Gathering, and Charleston, and all these little towns, to now. What's your message to everybody who loves pro wrestling the way that you did when you cut out to go meet Bret Hart and blow off senior day? What's your message to people who love wrestling as much as you, who have supported you in TNA and everything else that you've done in your endeavors?
John Skyler: Yeah, just love... If you love it, love it! And don't get caught up in all the BS. And if you like something that somebody else doesn't like, don't worry about it. Who cares? Like at the end of the day, do what makes you happy. And if wrestling makes you happy, like by all means, you know? And anybody that's ever supported me, you know, I am gratefully, gratefully appreciative of anybody that's ever supported me in my career, because thankfully I've been able to do this for 18 years now. And being a part of TNA for the last five has been really, really cool to see all the support not only for TNA, but for myself, and Jason, and so many others. But it's been a wild ride, man, and I'm just thankful every day that I get to wake up and call myself a professional wrestler, and that's something I take a lot of pride in.
Mike Johnson: All right, well we want to thank everybody for their support of PWInsiderElite.com. This Thursday evening, 9 PM Eastern, TNA returns to AMC live from the Liacouras Center in Philadelphia. You can get limited tickets now, and whether you go or whether you watch... Vote Cheex! Until next time, I'm Mike Johnson. Thanks—thank you, John.
John Skyler: Thank you!
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